Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
YaBB - Yet another Bulletin Board
  By continuing to use the forum you are agreeing to the updated Forum Rules. If you do not agree with the updated Forum Rules you may close your account.
  HomeHelpSearchMember MapLoginRegister ASSRA HomePage  
 
 
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print
38-55 cartridge length (Read 4416 times)
Irascible
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 253

Pleasant Valley, New York, USA
38-55 cartridge length
Mar 1st, 2008 at 1:25pm
 
Just wondering, has there ever been a facory rifle chambered only for the short W-W length case? Being that there are still long factory rounds about I would think that for safety reasons no, but I never underestimate the ability of humans to make mistakes.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Yellowhouse
Junior Forum Member
**
Offline



Posts: 37

Oklahoma, Oklahoma, USA
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #1 - Mar 31st, 2008 at 3:18pm
 
You can double check with them but I believe the current Shiloh Sharps offerings are made for the the "short brass".
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
wildbill
Full Forum Member
***
Offline



Posts: 83

Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #2 - Apr 1st, 2008 at 10:37am
 
I believe all new factory rifles are chambered for the "short" cartridge length. Unless you get a custom job and have a reamer made for an original chambering. Starline is now manufacturing both the short and original length cases. My first 38-55 was a 93 Marlin Carbine, and at the time (1970) the only factory loads, or brass for that matter was available from Imperial in Canada. I resorted to fireforming 30-30 cases. I still have these cases, (and the Marlin) and they are exactly the same length as the new W-W cases I have. I think Starline started making original length cases for those of us that have the old original rifles.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
feather
Full Forum Member
***
Offline



Posts: 71

Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #3 - Apr 2nd, 2008 at 4:27pm
 
Irascible,

About ten years ago I was considering having a rifle chambered for the 38-55. I wanted to shoot paper patch bullets in it. I learned about the long and short cases and requested a chamber and case drawing from SAAMI. At that time, (and I don't know of any reason why they would change it after nearly 100 years) the case drawing had the short length dimension on it and the chamber drawing had the long length dimension. The shorter cases can be fired in the long chamber but not vice versa. I felt that such a condition was not conducive to good accuracy with black powder and paper patch bullets. I had the rifle chambered in another caliber.

I suggest that you contact SAAMI and ask them or ask for a current drawing to see if that condition still exists. If they have not changed the SAAMI specification on the drawing, any rifle with a chamber that would only accept the short case would be considered a wildcat and not a standard chamber.

feather
Back to top
 

feather
 
IP Logged
 
montana_charlie
Full Forum Member
***
Offline



Posts: 149

Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #4 - Apr 12th, 2008 at 9:01pm
 
Here are two 'facts' about the 38-55 that you can consider to be 'hearsay' until you run across evidence that they are true.

As I understand it, the length of the 38-55 case got shortened on the day that Winchester decided to produce ammunition for (both) 38-55 and 30-30 from a single size of manufactured case blank.

Starline now offers the (old) long version of the 38-55 case because Pedersoli asked them to start.  The new Pedersoli 38-55 Hiwalls will be chambered for the original case length...and they wanted to make sure there would be a source for properly fitting brass.

CM
Back to top
 

Retired...twice. Now, just raisin' cows and livin' on borrowed time.
 
IP Logged
 
Cat_Whisperer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Werndl

Posts: 2661

Mountains of Virginia, Virginia, USA
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #5 - Apr 13th, 2008 at 8:55pm
 
Don't know about the 38-55; but when I expand or fire-form the .30-30 to the .375 Winchester the length is just right.

Back to top
 

Cat Whisperer (trk)
Chief of Smoke
Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works
Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army
assra #9885
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Irascible
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 253

Pleasant Valley, New York, USA
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #6 - Apr 18th, 2008 at 1:29pm
 
375 and 30-30 have the same length case. W-W 38-55 and 32-40 and the short Starline cases have the same length at 2.080. The original 38-55 and Starline long cases are longer than all the others at 2.120
I should also mention thet my Marlin Cowboy 336 has the full, original length chamber as does my Browning 1885 and my Ruger #1
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Hardymon
Newbie
*
Offline



Posts: 8

Marathon florida, Florida, USA
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #7 - Nov 2nd, 2008 at 2:46pm
 
feather wrote on Apr 2nd, 2008 at 4:27pm:
Irascible,

About ten years ago I was considering having a rifle chambered for the 38-55. I wanted to shoot paper patch bullets in it. I learned about the long and short cases and requested a chamber and case drawing from SAAMI. At that time, (and I don't know of any reason why they would change it after nearly 100 years) the case drawing had the short length dimension on it and the chamber drawing had the long length dimension. The shorter cases can be fired in the long chamber but not vice versa. I felt that such a condition was not conducive to good accuracy with black powder and paper patch bullets. I had the rifle chambered in another caliber.

I suggest that you contact SAAMI and ask them or ask for a current drawing to see if that condition still exists. If they have not changed the SAAMI specification on the drawing, any rifle with a chamber that would only accept the short case would be considered a wildcat and not a standard chamber.

feather

Hi Irascible
I bought a winchester high wall in 38-55 early this year one of the limited edition ones started studying on lenght the original was a ballard cartridge 2.129 winchester seeing a good thing brought out theirs at 2.89 I think it's in lymans reloading book The winchester is chambered for the long ones got them from starline. On the other hand my 94 win. in 38-55 will not even chamber the long cases but shoots saeco or lyman bullets at 255Gr. very well with 4227 at 18 gr. the highwall I shoot black 3f or pyrodex p. it likes the latter best.
Bob
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Ex Member
*****


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #8 - Nov 2nd, 2008 at 6:34pm
 
montana_charlie wrote on Apr 12th, 2008 at 9:01pm:
Here are two 'facts' about the 38-55 that you can consider to be 'hearsay' until you run across evidence that they are true.

As I understand it, the length of the 38-55 case got shortened on the day that Winchester decided to produce ammunition for (both) 38-55 and 30-30 from a single size of manufactured case blank.

CM


Close! Winchester introduced the .375 Winchester with it's shorter case, and when they did they just used the same case for the .38-55 and a different stamp on the case.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
sakoman
Full Forum Member
***
Offline



Posts: 175

Phoenix, AZ, USA
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #9 - Nov 2nd, 2008 at 8:19pm
 
Does any one know what length the late Uberti/Cimerron 38-55 rifles are chambered for?
Back to top
 
sakoman sakoman  
IP Logged
 
mriisj
Full Forum Member
***
Offline



Posts: 138

Copenhagen, Denmark
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #10 - Nov 3rd, 2008 at 10:43am
 
Both Uberti and the new Pedersoli is the short ones, the CPA is the long one.

Michael
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Green_Frog
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


"It ain't easy being green"

Posts: 2866

Lynchburg, VA, Virginia, USA
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #11 - Nov 3rd, 2008 at 4:57pm
 
Michael,

I must respectfully disagree with you.  When we did the product review for SSR-J on the Starline brass, we got their long brass and used it in a Uberti high-wall as delivered.  That was the correct brass for that Uberti, and I have every confidence that the Ubertis at least should all be expected to have long (or rather, full length) chambers.

Regards,
Froggie
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Jeff_Schultz
ASSRA Board Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 344

Ransomville, NY, New York, USA
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #12 - Nov 3rd, 2008 at 5:35pm
 
Close! Winchester introduced the .375 Winchester with it's shorter case, and when they did they just used the same case for the .38-55 and a different stamp on the case.

I'm not sure that's true. Everything I've read says the 375 Win. is heavier brass to stand the higher pressure; 52,000 CUP for 375 Win. vs 38,000 CUP for 30-30 Win.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Ex Member
*****


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #13 - Nov 3rd, 2008 at 7:23pm
 
I've heard that story too, but late Win. .38-55 cases seem to check as the same volume as .375 cases, so I'm not sure where they hid the extra metal.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
mriisj
Full Forum Member
***
Offline



Posts: 138

Copenhagen, Denmark
Re: 38-55 cartridge length
Reply #14 - Nov 4th, 2008 at 5:53am
 
Charlie

I might be we wrong on the Uberti, I only have one source of this rifle, a HW that a member of our local club shooters and he is using the short brass but I have never measured his chamber but I will try get a hold of his HW and check on Saturday.

Regarding the Pedersoli I called them and they answer was the short brass, same thing with CPA just they use the long brass.

Michael
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 
Send Topic Print