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AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759 (Read 4371 times)
creedmoormatch
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AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Jun 13th, 2012 at 7:15pm
 

  I am presently involved ( on those non-rainy days) in developing schuetzen (200 yards) and Silhouette (none BPCR) loads for the 38-55 cartridge.

  It has been suggested to me that AA 5744 will out perform the old tried and true, SR-4759, which I am about to run out of.  I am wondering if now might be the time for me to try 5744 for the first time ever.

  Apparently 5744 burns a lot cleaner, for whatever that is worth.  Do these powders load the same as each other, even up, grain for grain?

Looking for advice that might lead to a success story.  Thanks in advance.

  Creedmoormatch
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J Louis
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #1 - Jun 13th, 2012 at 8:15pm
 
You would be better served if you moved away from both if you plan on being extremely competitive in the Schuetzen game. 4759 is the better of two by a long shot but I have found the magnum pistol ball powders to be a better choice. If you have an interest in heading in that direction send me a PM with your e-mail address and I can get you headed to that road of success.

J.Louis
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MerwinBray
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #2 - Jun 15th, 2012 at 9:14am
 
Webb,

When I started down the 38-55 schuetzen load path the advice overwhelmingly given to me by many many seasoned shooters was IMR-4227.

I have very very little experience with the 5744 in the 38-55, only a hand full of fixed before the gun was worked over some. So I am no good there, but 4227 is another tried and true successful powder.

Of course, having a 38-55 and most of a can of 5744, I would be interested in your results if you do go that route.

Jon
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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #3 - Jun 15th, 2012 at 12:39pm
 
I shot a fair amount of 5744 in 45-70 and 38-55.   my (lack of) skill is such that I cannot comment on the relative accuracy.  but I'm shooting 4759 now and in my experience the 5744 leaves a lot more debris in the barrel than 4759.
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boats
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #4 - Jun 15th, 2012 at 12:49pm
 
On one Relative Quickness chart 5744 is 16,  4759 17, And 4227's are split with 16 & 17

http://www.gsgroup.co.za/burnrates.html

I have found these charts to be useful indicators but not precise. Lot to lot powders will change.

Way I see it similar octane, one's Exxon one's Shell other is BP It doesn't make any difference but drivers do have there favorites.

J Louis use of Magnum Ball powders is moving in another direction and very successful. 

Boats
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Mike65
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #5 - Jun 15th, 2012 at 9:13pm
 
Have to agree with DW.  When I used 5744 in my 45-70 there was a lot of unburned powder left in the bore.  It was dirty enough, and no fun to shoot off from the bench, that I went back to black.  Smaller cases, maybe a different outcome.
Mike
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RoyB
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #6 - Mar 8th, 2013 at 3:25pm
 
Bringing back an old thread.....

My experience with these two powders is that 5744 works great with heavy for caliber bullets (330g in the 38-55 and 500+g in the 45-70) and you might want a relatively tight crimp. Otherwise you will see lots of unburnt powder and a dirty bore. This is with cast bullets as I don't shoot jacketed.

4759 works much better in the lighter bullets (250g for 38-55 and 300-420g for 45-70) Much cleaner and seemingly better ignition. But 4759 also works great with the heavier bullets.

In the 38-55 I've had fantastic success with Unique. Clean, low recoil and superb accuracy with the 250-280g bullets.

I keep hearing good things about 4227 and I bought a can to try.......as soon as it stops snowing around here! I need to go out and shovel 12" of "Light Flurries" in a few minutes! Angry
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mes
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #7 - Mar 8th, 2013 at 3:52pm
 
Cast Bullet Association members use a lot of 5744 with there gas checked bullets and seem to do quite well with it. 

I have tried it in several different cartridges with plain base bullets and it has never worked as well as 4759.
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rkaires
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #8 - Mar 8th, 2013 at 4:24pm
 
I tried AA5744 in my 40-65 for a while. 20 - 22 grains with a 400gr BPS bullet. Too much unburnt powder for me.

I'm using IMR4227 and 4759 with better results and no unburnt powder residue.
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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #9 - Mar 8th, 2013 at 5:49pm
 
My impression is that 5744 is a high bulk/(relatively) low pressure designed for heavy bullet loads in large cases.  I believe it was originally a surplus powder used in the .50 BMG.

Even though it is nominally a low-pressure powder it seems to burn more completely with more pressure within its range.   IE 500 gr bullets in 45-70 (or solidly crimped 400 grain ones on an experimental basis).   Even though there were unburned grains left in my rifle's 27" bore with 510 gr bullets it shot very well off the bench @ 200 yds (we won't discuss recoil).  I was using substantial 25 gr+ charges and a cork over powder wad and breech seating the original nose-pour Lyman-Matthews bullet.

I later had DARR-Borton moulds made that precisely scaled that bullet down for 40 cal and for 38-55.   I've never got around to getting the 40 cal rifle up and running but the 38-55 shot almost as well with 5744, again shot breech-seated.

I have since pretty much focussed on 22 rf specifically to learn to shoot offhand and to develop better shooting skills.
When I get back to center-fire it will be with a late era Swiss martini international rifle in 7.5x55 and with 4759 loads

I still have several cans of 5744 and if I decide to start shooting buffalo matches that would be my powder choice for the 45-70

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.22-5-40
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #10 - Mar 9th, 2013 at 2:07am
 
The most accurate smokeless I have found in an original No.1 Remington rolling block .40-50 B.N. is 5744.  and this is with an NEI 275gr. bullet..the original weight for this ctg.  Yet no matter what bullet, or how hard I try..I can't get the stuff to shoot with the accuracy of other powders in the .40-70 straight or B.N.
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boats
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #11 - Mar 9th, 2013 at 7:21am
 
Could be the 40/50 Bottleneck case produces more pressure than something with straight sides and gives a better burn with the AA 5744 Speculation only

Big advantage ot 4759 or 4227 they don't need a strong bullet pull or heavy bullet to burn well. Listen to the guys with good results in 45/70 using 3031 or RX 7 all use heavy bullets and strong crimps .

I use 4 single shot powders. Black in any of them, 4759 in the larger cases 4227 in the smaller and Unique when I want sub sonic with light bullets. Others may work well these 4 cover all requirements

Boats
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zrifleman
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #12 - Mar 9th, 2013 at 12:36pm
 
The original 5744 that was offered was military surplus powder. Thenew XMP5744 is new manufacture. Although similiar they are not the same. The original powder for me burned cleaner in 45-70 and had better accuracy. SR4759 remains my favorite of the two.
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40_Rod
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #13 - Mar 10th, 2013 at 8:57am
 
Both powders shoot pretty dirty at Black powder velocities. I can't say about 5744 as I tried it years ago got pretty indifferent accuracy and dropped it.
  4759 shoots cleaner the more that you push it. It shoots pretty clean about the time that it shouldn't be shot in all but the strongest actions. However it does shoot very well in a wide range of cartridges from .32s up to the big .50s.  The fly in the ointment with 4759 is that it doesn't meter well small quantities. The .38-55 is right about on the dividing line above that it meters OK below that you need to drop short and trickle powder in to a given weight.
MP300 is a ball powder That John Lewis and others have used with great results. It is a ball powder and meters well for best results Winchester Magnum  primers Must be used.

40 Rod
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FITZ
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Re: AA5744 vs. IMR SR-4759
Reply #14 - Mar 10th, 2013 at 12:22pm
 
40 Rod your experience with 4759 mimics some advice I got years ago from a very experienced shooter, and I quote. "If you are shooting 4759 and get a clean bore you are shooting it too HOT" I have suspected for some time that 4759 was actually a fairly fast powder. The last batch I bought was from a surplus Military ammo dealer. When I asked what his source was he replied it was salvaged from .308 Blank ammo for M14s. Now we all know that Blank ammo powder has to be capable of developing some pressure with no projectile. I use it in all my Hiwall and Borchardt rifles with stiff loads and have had no trouble. But they are robustly strong actions. The real saving is it is a bulky powder and you just cannot overload it in cases like the 32-40, 33-40,and 38-55. I am very cautious when I shoot it in my .40 and .45 caliber rifles. HTH Regards, FITZ. Smiley Addition, by not overload I meant double charge. I use 15.5 Grs in 32-40, and 18.5 in 38-55, and again 15.5 in the one 33-40 I have. FITZ.
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