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Identify Swiss (Read 1239 times)
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Identify Swiss
Aug 19th, 2013 at 12:06pm
 
This rifle belongs to a friend of mine. Real nice in person great "feel" (Rifle that is) He wondered if anybody knows anything about them including loading info.

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More photos in 2nd post

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Swiss hunting rifle Vetterli 10.4 x 42 cal. barrel is 32 3/4 inches long. On the right side plate is: A: HAURI    
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Re: Identify Swiss
Reply #1 - Aug 19th, 2013 at 12:10pm
 
On loading data, He's experienced single shot and Muzzle loader. No need for basic just any tips we can provide.

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Buffalo is Ed's friend who owns the Swiss Rifle. So far he is the only guy in our club who has hit it 10 for 10 shots offhand at 500 meters.  With his 38/55 CPA

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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Identify Swiss
Reply #2 - Aug 19th, 2013 at 12:55pm
 
That could be a swiss "federal" "stutzen",  a quasi-military target rifle. local gunsmiths assembled stutzen/target rifles and stalking rifles based on the military arm using higher grade components.  they were build to a standardized configuration. In general the Swiss rifles had a barrel mounted high grade open sight as part of the "federal" configuration spec.  Or it could be an earlier actual military Martini from the period when they were transitioning to the early bolt Vetterelli from the single shot Martini mil rifles. 
I have a very similar rifle, minus the military full stock.  Mine is in a 9.5x47r cartridge.  it is a very plain stalking rifle ---I think.  The basic rear sight is simply dovetailed into the upper flat just like this one.  It also had thimbles for a now missing cleaning rod
   A chamber cast will clarify the cartridge form.  You may be able to form and fireform from existing brass.  Alternatively RMC can make cases from a chamber cast---I've had them do several  for me for old obsolete euro-singleshots  they are bottle necked on the outside but internally thickwalled with a straight sided powder cavity.   Sort of an "everlasting" on steroids.  Accurate Molds has made a few versions of old euro-bullets based on early german-swiss catalogue drawings that work very well
there is a site especially for Swiss arms.  its not the most active one on the internet but it does have a lot of good info especially on the military arms.  not as much on the civilian stuff but there is some so its work digging through their archives

http://theswissriflesdotcommessageboard.yuku.com/

once you identify the cartridge,  (do a chamber cast and post a measured sketch--some of us might have a version of it in hand) the CBA guys may have some info in their archives too

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« Last Edit: Aug 19th, 2013 at 1:20pm by QuestionableMaynard8130 »  

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Re: Identify Swiss
Reply #3 - Aug 19th, 2013 at 1:16pm
 
BT THE WAY    REALLY NICE RIFLE


The Handloaders Manual of Cartridge Conversions lists the following:

A 10.4x38r Swiss Veterelli   (referencing COTW p 210) whihc has a slight body taper and a short sharp houlder to the necl

A 10.4X42r Swiss Vetereli with a shorter body and a longer tapered shoulder to a long neck  ---but not as long as a BN Mauser case

A 10.4 x 47r Vetereli-Vitali, an Italian almost semi-rimmed case

And a 10.5x47r   (no national designation) referenced to COTW p. 276.  this one can be made from 43 Spanish so I hope its what your buddy has.  the load listed of it is a 275 gr lead bullet and 28.9 gr of IMR 4198

gunsmiths of that pre-standardized-cartridge-spec era often had slight variations, creating proprietary cartridges.  A cartridge with a nominally standard name might or might not actually accept a "factory round".
However if Swiss guns were made to "federal" spec they were created to function with the gvmt. issue ammo for that time.  This was all a part of the Swiss military armed citizen/soldier culture
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Re: Identify Swiss
Reply #4 - Aug 19th, 2013 at 3:21pm
 
Back in '85, I had a very similar rifle in 10.4x38R. The research I did on it at the time, said it was a Swiss "conscription" rifle. A weapon required to be owned for marksmanship training and to protect the country. About the only difference between this one and mine was mine had a scroll at the rear of the lever.

Since mine was RF and I didn't want to ruin the orginality of it by modifing the firing pin, I sold it.

Frank
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Re: Identify Swiss
Reply #5 - Aug 19th, 2013 at 4:16pm
 
Good tips all, will have a look at the firing pin and if possible make a chamber cast.    Ferrosafe in that action may be a challenge.  I figure take the stock off drop the block and make a funnel.

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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Identify Swiss
Reply #6 - Aug 19th, 2013 at 5:13pm
 
That's what I had to do.  and I got the plug so deep in the throat the throat barrel portion bent a little when I drove it back out.  I wanted to be sure to get the bore & groove in the cast--and over did it a bit.   Suggestion: use a heat gun or a good hot hair dryer to preheat the barrel and breech.  you'll get a better cast

Mine has an almost identical rear sight, but it has a wind gauge front sight with two protective curved wings that almost meet at the top.  one wing is badly bent and I have to disassemble it and tinker it back into shape, mine also has a more "schuetzen-ish" lever as well

here is a link I hope to a thread that JohnBoy ran about our adventures with the 9.5x47r    I'll also try to find the thread the Jspencer (for the German Gun collectors Assn) posted with a page or two from an original catalogue of a German bullet supply house

Reloading the Single Shot Rifle / Re: 9.5X47R Bullets   

It didn't do a direct link but i you cut and paste that into the search screen  and set the search date for 1 year you should be able to pull it up


I can't find the catalogue page  and it had a number of pages with different bullet sketches like an old lyman mould catalogue--except they were all swedged bullets.  You might PM JSpencer and see if he has pages that show that bore/groove diameter.   If you get a basic diagram it can be drafted up and accurate molds can make a bullet mold, easily accurately and promptly
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« Last Edit: Aug 19th, 2013 at 5:36pm by QuestionableMaynard8130 »  

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Re: Identify Swiss
Reply #7 - Aug 19th, 2013 at 9:32pm
 
Thanks again. Ed will appreciate the help.  Like to see the old boy up and running. Rifle that is.

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