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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Schuetzen Loads (Read 109132 times)
40_Rod
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #30 - Dec 4th, 2010 at 7:56am
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Sendaro
For your gun I would recommend 4227 or 4759. 4227 meters easier in the small amounts needed for 32-40. You may need to up your charge slightly but don't go beyond 14.5. Do not under any circumstances use H110 in a 44. People have reported odd pressure spikes with that powder loose in a large case and earlier this year I published pictures of a Winchester High wall that had been double charged. Unique has a potential for disaster although it has been used for indoor squib loads.

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KAF
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #31 - Dec 4th, 2010 at 8:19am
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"I do find a lot of partially burnt powder in the bore. It has been suggested to me that the pressure is low and that is why the powder in leaving the partially burnt crumbs in the bore."

In looking at your bullets, it looks to me that the reason you are not getting enough pressure to burn all you powder, is they are a bit to small for your groove dia. I do not see much engraving of the rifleing.
A larger dia bullet would ad more resistance and the powder would burn more efficiently.
This is just my observation, nothing says I am a expert.

Thoughts from others?
  

Keith L 3240
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westerner
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #32 - Dec 4th, 2010 at 8:24am
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H 110 is hard to ignite. Manley Oakley did intensional blowups with a Ruger #1 in 32/40, .32 Miller and 6 BR.  He managed to blow the rifle up twice. By blow up I mean the case exited the action in both cases. Parts were bent in the action.  

Manley theorized that H110 was blown into the neck area which created a mechanical plug causing detonation.  I think, both blow ups were accomplished with the 6BR type case. Manley recommended magnum primers and a wad if you had to use H110 powder for reduced loads.  

I think a bad combination would be a pistol primer, H110 and fixed ammo.  Just theorizing. Wont use H110 for reduced loads in anything.

                                      Joe.  Smiley
« Last Edit: Dec 4th, 2010 at 8:30am by westerner »  
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Sendaro
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #33 - Dec 6th, 2010 at 7:26am
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Thanks Guys. I had red flags up about using H110 or 296 in the 32-40. There would be a lot of extra room and I remember form my loading of handgun cartridges the advice that was given there many years ago about reduced loads.
   The bullets that I'm shooting are not sized. They are dropping from the mold at .322". As it is with most all bullets from a mold they are not round to start with. Wonder it getting a .321 die for my lube & sizer would make any differance. I just keep getting so much conflicting advice about sizing cast bullets and shooting them as they come from the mold. It would appear to me that the bullets at .321 to .322" are sealing the bore. I'm getting no leading or gas cutting. There is a nice even ridge of lube around the muzzle of my rifle after shooting sevral shots. Looks like I will have to spend more time at my shooting lab this winter to get this project sorted out. That in itself is not a bad passtime in the winter months. Thanks again, Sendaro
  
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frnkeore
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #34 - Dec 6th, 2010 at 2:12pm
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Is the groove on your rifle .319? I don't know SAECO numbers but if any of your bullets are tapered, don't size them. If they breech seat easily, don't size them, either. You haven't said anything about how your breech seating. Your breech seater needs to fit the chamber well and the bullet. About .001 clearance for the BSer in the chamber and .001 clearance for the bullet inside the BSer. If your using a fired case to BS, size the last 1/4" to .001 over the bullet.

The other thing is the BS depth. What are you using for that? A card wad should take care of the peening on the bases of the bullets.

I always use pistol primers with all my powders (except WC820) and  Rem 2 1/2 with 4759. Fed 150's work with most everything but, I haven't had much luck with Fed 210's. Win LR seem to work for most people though.

Frank
  

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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #35 - Dec 6th, 2010 at 5:31pm
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frnkeore, The groove dia is .319. I do not size the SAECO #632 bullet. It is a tapered one. I was told to make a breach seating tool by using a cartridge case with a wood dowle inserted with approx. 1/16" sticking out and as square as I can make it. It seems to work OK with the tapered bullets, but the Lyman #319247 bullets that I'm casting and have some that I bought are not a tapered bullet and it is very very hard to breach seat them. So those I load as fixed ammo. I have been trying them different ways. One way is with the cartridge case not resized, but just reprimed, charged and the bullet seated with my fingers. I leave it long so that as I close the breach on the cartridge it seats the bullet to the lead ramps on the rifling. Sometimes this shoots great and then every once in a while one takes a flyer. The loading dies that I have are the RCBS Cowboy action shooting dies that are designed for lead bullets. The expander die is much like the die that Lyman offers. If I was to make a card wad to protect the bullet base would it fall away as the bullet exited the muzzle? I assume that the card wad would not be pushed down on the top or the powder charge. Please advise. I have Winchester / Western 7-111 large pistol primers that are a standard primer. I could try them instead of the Federal 210 primer that I have been using. I also have Remington 2 1/2 primers that I could use. Again your suggestions are a help. I have added a photo that will show my Stevens 44 in 32-40 Winchester along with some of my old 22 rimfire rifles.Thanks, Sendaro
  
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frnkeore
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #36 - Dec 6th, 2010 at 7:53pm
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Hi Sendaro,
Your 44 looks much like mine. Does yours have a #2 or #3 barrel? Mines a #3, it's stamped on the bottom of the barrel. My barrel is also .319 groove  with a .315 bore (.002 deep rifling). There is a pic of it in the picture thread.

Mine will shoot 1" groups at 100 yds with a BSed 319274 Ideal bullet (180 gr), 12.2 gr (20 gr by volume on a Lyman measure) 4759 and a 2 1/2 Rem primer. My barrel is as new on the rifle. Other target loads of 4227 should also do well with most pistol primers.

BS a bullet, tap it back out. Measure from the base of it to the start of where it first makes contact with the groove diameter. You want that to measure between .035 and .050. A magic marker may help you see that location if you coat the base with it.

My fixed BP load is 6 gr 4759 same primer, fill with FG so the cartridge just seats. Neck size the case about 1/4" at .001 larger than the bullet so, it just slips in. My gun will will shoot under 2" at 100 that way w/o cleaning. I've never used a card wad but, you would put it under the bullet against the BP. They do fall off. If you use a wad with the smokeless, put it at the mouth of the case. Make it large enough that it stays there. Try the tapered bullet with the BP, use a soft lube like Darr or Emmert

If your going to shoot it a lot, get a BSer made that has a adj piston to push the bullet in to place.

Hope that helps,

Frank
  

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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #37 - Dec 6th, 2010 at 9:03pm
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Frank, Where do I go to have a breach seater made? I'm not sure even what they look like. Who do you suggest? I will try your suggestions. Thanks for the help. Most of this is new to me. Have been a hand loader for rifle, pistol, and shotgun for 46 years, but loading for cast bullets in a rifle is new to me. My casting was done for pistols for many years, but they shot well with about anything that I cast when shot at less then 50 yards. I'm learning about casting, loading and shooting this old Stevens 32-40. It's fun and I'm sure with the help of shooters like you and my years of loading adn shooting I will end up cracking this nut in the long run. Thanks, Sendaro
  
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #38 - Dec 8th, 2010 at 7:53pm
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Look in the for sale here, there was a member making them for resale.
  

I'm for any sport that burns powder, I just look down a different set of barrels than most folks.  __Elmer Keith
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #39 - Dec 8th, 2010 at 10:54pm
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Would I be able to breach seat bullet that are not the tapered type as well as the tapered ones? I shot a breach seated bullet today that shot very well. Using a tang sight (Lyman #103)  and a Maynard globe front was able to shoot a very nice little group. I removed the Wm Malcolm 6X reproduction scope and shot the aforementioned to sight the rifle in with the new front globe. I was very happy with the results. First shot went low at 100 yards so the elevation was cranked up and shot #2 sent down the range. It came in less than 3/8" low. Cranked the elevation up two more clicks and the next three rounds cut each other in the bulls eye at 6 O'clock. Two more clicks in elevation got the point of impact up in the area of center bull, but I lost one. Called the shot out at 9 o'clock and it was there when I checked in the spotting scope. see the test target.



  
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #40 - May 9th, 2011 at 6:03pm
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Hi, I am new to thid forum.  My dad has done some trading and cme up with a beautiful Schutzen in 28-30-120 Stevens.  The action is a Stevens 54, if he sent the e-mail correctly.  Did Stevens make a 54?  I have found one load mentioned on this forum for the 28 Stevens.  does anyone out there have others?  I was given RMC for brass.  I know about Stars and Stripes Ammo.  Does anyone out there have boxes and boxes of this brass that they wish to sell one?  Is there a way to reform another caliber brass to fit?  Any information or anticdotes on this gun/ caliber would be appreciated.  Thanks.
  
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #41 - Dec 15th, 2011 at 5:08pm
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In my 32-40 Hi Wall with a 1:14 bbl, I've had good luck with 15.3 gr 4198, Fed 205 primer, with a Paul Jones "French" or a Saeco bullet.  I lube Beeswax 6parts, 2-3 parts safflower oil, 1 or 2 parts lanolin.  pan lubed  Works good for me! Roll Eyes
  
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #42 - Mar 25th, 2012 at 2:53pm
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.32 Krag. 

Breech seated 170 gr tapered. 15.5 gr Lilgun. LRP
  
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #43 - May 4th, 2012 at 11:47am
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25-21 Stevens
    100gr bullet,25/1,BS
    7.5grs AA-9
    Rem 71/2 SRBR
  
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Re: Schuetzen Loads
Reply #44 - Feb 18th, 2013 at 5:17pm
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Has anyone used AA7 for there 38-55?
  
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