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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle (Read 1929 times)
Alwion
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Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Sep 2nd, 2017 at 12:04pm
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I picked this up yesterday because I liked the wood and hardware. researched it and believe it to be pre 1900? I am primarily a bayonet collector, and some military rifles. can anyone give me more details and possibly a source for the missing parts, or even an opinion if its worth restoring the rest of the way. needs two sling rings, a lever screw, and sights. I believe the forearm is possibly an old replacement, some rust starting on barrel. I on bottom of receiver, crown over ? under barrel, a V and a couple numbers
  
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Alwion
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #1 - Sep 2nd, 2017 at 12:05pm
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under barrel markings
  
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Alwion
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #2 - Sep 2nd, 2017 at 12:06pm
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another pic
  
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Alwion
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #3 - Sep 2nd, 2017 at 12:08pm
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other side
  
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Alwion
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #4 - Sep 2nd, 2017 at 12:09pm
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I also have a few more pictures if it helps
  
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Alwion
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #5 - Sep 4th, 2017 at 3:38pm
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can anyone direct me to parts for this? diopter post sights seem rare
  
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jfeldman
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #6 - Sep 5th, 2017 at 12:51pm
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Alwion, if you look at the top section of the For Sale section under Single Shot Products, you will find a post about a guy who makes up diopters for old German/Swiss rifles.  Might give him a call.  I have no experience with him.

Regards, Joe
  
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marlinguy
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but they sure are neater!

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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #7 - Sep 5th, 2017 at 12:56pm
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Ron Heilman makes very nice quality repro sights for those guns.
I personally would not restore this gun, but I would do whatever is needed to get it functioning, and gently clean it up. It's in nice enough shape to keep the restoration more sympathetic, rather than a full blown rework.
  

Vall
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westerner
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #8 - Sep 5th, 2017 at 1:31pm
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Peterlongo? Parts? Get your files out and roll up your sleeves.


               Joe.
  
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Alwion
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #9 - Sep 8th, 2017 at 5:39pm
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ty, no I can clean a gun w/o damaging the patina, it doesn't need that.  Smiley
  
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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #10 - Sep 10th, 2017 at 1:48pm
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That is a REAL interesting rifle.
It looks to me to be a basic early Swiss or German-Swiss (?) hunting (AKA "Stalking) rifle based on an Peabody-type Martini action.   The missing tang sight was probably a early basic "lollipop" sight went into that plain square tang-boss with a simple lock screw for rough elevation adjustment and limited windage built into the aperture-slide; as opposed to the later finally adjustable german "diopter target sights"
   I call it "German-Swiss" since the plain simplicity of the stock looks more Swiss to me than the more elaborate florid and elaborate formal german target rifles.   However most of the Swiss rifles I have owned or handled had NO provision for a tang sight---hence the German-Swiss.   However the barrel stamping marks may provide more information to more knowledgable collectors.
I owned one a LOT like that, but it was a later straight swiss-Martini with barrel-mounted sights and and of course minus the peabody-type outside hammer.  As I recall the Swiss did build sporting and military arms on the Peabody-outside-hammer pattern titling-block action prior to the "Martini" modifications to the basic action.
Have you done a chamber cast yet?   that will tell a lot.  It can be done pretty easily if the action is diasassembled  if not a long cast that includes the fires inch or so off the barrel may be too long to make the turn up the 'feed-ramp: on top of the block  (don't ask how I learned that)  I suspect it is probably chambered for one of the early 1870-1890 big bore Black-powder European  cartridges.   Slugging the bore will help as would a bore cast---unless the bore is too pitted and the pits lock the cast.  Give the bore a repeated good soak and clean.

Bill Loos is a collector provider of both original sights and all part-original-part originals versions. (I will PM you his contact info)  there are some very good gunsmiths here on the sight that are perfectly capable of reproducing any missing parts, checking condition and safety, and if the bore is really bad---providing you with alternative approaches to make it shootable.
  

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oneatatime
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #11 - Sep 10th, 2017 at 7:32pm
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That doesn't appear to be a hammer but rather an external cocking piece. Be interesting to see if inside there is a hammer and not a striker. Peabody's patent for a "hammerless" action (pre Martini striker) had an internal hammer but I believe it was cocked internally.
  
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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #12 - Sep 10th, 2017 at 10:45pm
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I agree, a "hammer-looking" cocking lever.  Notice too the lower tang looks to be removable for cleaning and oiling the DST mechanism.

I'd to see a close up of the left side of the action. and whatever is on the little brass plate on the right side of the stock,  oh, and a view of the muzzle including the front sight base.

 
  

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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #13 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 6:35pm
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alwion,   "Blind-eye" just posted a good looking Lollipop sight in the for sale/trade/buy tube forum.  It looks like just the right kind of sight your rifle is missing.  If the square shank fits or can be shaved down to fit it would solve your missing rear sight  issue.   and the price he s asking is VERY fair.
  

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Alwion
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Re: Swiss? Schuetzen martini target rifle
Reply #14 - Sep 16th, 2017 at 9:45pm
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terribly busy week, have read the posts, thanks for the info. no, I don't know how to take it apart or do a casting. . Miking the front, appears to be a 41 cal . I originally thought from research swiss, but the crown over something mark looks more belgium to me, and from style thought pre 1900. yes the lever is only for dropping the loading "slide", with it down I couldn't see the firing pin. there is no name on the oval plate, nore does it appear to have ever had one. Theres a gunsmith an hr away who does some work on similar rifles, but he is away for awhile
  
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