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silver
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Fire foarming brass
Oct 7th, 2018 at 10:34am
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Looked for info here could not find any in relation.
I want to fire form 60 pcs. Of 40-65 cases . I have some 4198 ,
How many grains would be recommended? And I've heard of corn meal on top . Any kind of wad on top of corn meal?
Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Thanks

Doug
  
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frnkeore
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #1 - Oct 7th, 2018 at 12:34pm
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My method for fire forming is to, look in a reloading book for cast bullets. I usually use the Lyman #2 cast reloading book, because it has lots of fast burning powders for all listings.

I find the heaviest charge, for the LIGHTEST bullet listed, after charging the case with that, I then fill the the case with C of W or C M, then I smear the case mouth with a heavily with bullet lube, making a thin wad of it.

It's then ready to fire. I always use Unique, because I think the impulse of faster burning powder does a better job and it takes less powder.

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oneatatime
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #2 - Oct 7th, 2018 at 12:47pm
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Thinking about this, if they are already 40-65 cases and one just wants to make an exact fit to your chamber, would it be a good idea to bell the case mouth just enough to make sure the neck is centered in the chamber? Typically I use about 9 grains of a fast pistol or shotgun powder and Cream of Wheat. Corn meal makes a stink. I roll some bullet lube out real thin between 2 sheets of wax paper and just cut a circle out over the case mouth.
  
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beltfed
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #3 - Oct 7th, 2018 at 2:21pm
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Silver,
My suggestion is what I have done for my 40-65 brass FFing:
load about 25 grains of 4227 or 4759 or 5744under
some 0.410 lead pistol bullets and enjoy shooting them
I have some Meister bullets I will share with you.
I will bring you some to the ICC meeting Tuesday night, 7pm
Arnie    aka beltfed
  
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Reverend Al
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #4 - Oct 7th, 2018 at 2:46pm
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I've been fire-forming quite a bit of brass for .40-90 Ballard, .40-60 Maynard, and .40-50 Sharps recently and have had great success with the following.  First I anneal the cases and seat a primer.  I load 7.5 grains of Nitro Trap 100 (since I have a fair bit of it on hand, but any fast burning shotgun or pistol powder will work) and then seat a 1/4 sheet of toilet tissue over the powder charge.  I fill to the case mouth with bulk yellow cornmeal and then seat another 1/4 sheet of toilet tissue to hold everything in place on the way to the range.  I press the toilet tissue in place with a piece of wooden dowel.  They snap out close to fully formed and blow out completely on the first firing with a full charge and a bullet.  So far so good in 4 different rifles and I haven't lost a single case to splits.

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marlinguy
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #5 - Oct 7th, 2018 at 3:07pm
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If they're already .40-65 brass, and you want to form them to your rifle, I'd simply load them and shoot them myself.
I've shot groups with brass that did a fair amount of forming, and often the groups were close to or as good as those shot on subsequent firings.
  

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JLouis
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #6 - Oct 7th, 2018 at 3:35pm
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I pretty much do the same I use my standard powder charge for instance 14.2 grains of 300MP for my 32-40 fill the rest of the case with corn meal and top it off with a 0.030 thousands vegetable fiber wad. For my 28-35SS I turned a expander button to expand the 25-35 necks to a scrape fit and then the body simply blows itself out.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #7 - Oct 7th, 2018 at 7:26pm
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I top mine off with the bullet I'm using and simply shoot them for group. A number of times the groups are pretty darn good.
I had some 9.3x74R I belled out to .40-85 Everlasting for my Pacific, and was just shooting them with my 330 gr. .40 caliber bullet. I just wanted to get them final formed, so wasn't really paying attention to accuracy. My brother was spotting and after 5 shots at 100 yds. he told me I had a nice group going. Looked through the spotting scope and saw a 1.5" group, so decided to move over to a 2nd target and try to shoot the rest of the loads with a better hold.
The other 15 grouped into just over 1" while forming the cases, and the next trip out with formed cases was the same. Good enough that had I known it, I'd have taken the less than fully formed cases out on our elk hunt with me and not worried.
  

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GT
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #8 - Oct 7th, 2018 at 11:49pm
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I've been forming more cases than I care to admit lately, and like the rest of the comments posted here, a fast burning powder works best - I have an 8 pounder of bullseye so that's my choice.  The only thing I've done different than what's been mentioned here is I compress the cream of wheat slightly with a wooden dowel and cap the whole works with hot glue - I use the big glue gun and the larger sticks...  somebody mentioned that the glue would foul the barrel - haven't seen any signs yet and I've done about 200 in my 38-72 and 150 for an Ackley Improved.

Here's another story, but I got a wild hair and cast some glue bullets to disperse some vermin, hopefully I'll have some time and start a post about it.   Wink 
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #9 - Oct 8th, 2018 at 11:30am
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GT, those glue bullets will give new meaning to the phrase, "stick it to 'em".
  

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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #10 - Oct 8th, 2018 at 1:31pm
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They sure knock the feathers loose on the flying rats (pigeons) but I'm not much of a wing shooter with the 45-60 roller - think I'm one for 40 and he was just taking flight - wings were moving so that counts doesn't it?
  

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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #11 - Oct 8th, 2018 at 1:33pm
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For such a 'gentle' fireforming, I'd just use a normal load and shoot...  Bullet and powder, standard load.
  
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #12 - Oct 8th, 2018 at 3:24pm
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For such a 'gentle' fireforming, I'd just use a normal load and shoot...  Bullet and powder, standard load.
  
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #13 - Oct 8th, 2018 at 10:44pm
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There are more ways to fire form cases than there are ways to skin a cat.  I used some powder that I wasn't going to save for something important, 4198 I think.  Then used a normal load and used a wad of fresh silly putty, got to use it before it dries out.  I have heard of using potato sliced 1/2 inch or so thick and press it down on the case neck, probably should use a card wad to keep moisture out of the powder. 

If you use brass that needs to stretch a lot, or it is old, better fire form it first or it may split.  I'm really talking about making brass from other calibers, like 40-70 Sharps from 30-40 Krag, etc.

James
  
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beltfed
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Re: Fire foarming brass
Reply #14 - Oct 8th, 2018 at 10:55pm
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ColJimmy,
Did you mean Anneal the brass first?
beltfed/arnie
  
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