Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 Send TopicPrint
Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin (Read 1457 times)
Remington40x
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 161
Location: Bucks County, PA
Joined: Oct 18th, 2007
Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Oct 22nd, 2018 at 9:26am
Print Post  
I have an early Winchester Hi-Wall (serial number 27xx) that is missing its firing pin. 

The rifle is not wholly original.  The barrel is quite heavy (over 0.8" diameter at the muzzle), 27 inches long,  marked J.W. Van Patten (who I dimly recall being a gunsmith during the post-WWII years) and is marked .218 Bee, a cartridge that long post-dates the era of the serial number.  The gun has been restocked, probably at the time the replacement barrel was fitted and the action poorly polished and reblued over some remaining pits.  It has since been rechambered to .219 Zipper Improved.  The breech face has been bushed and the firing pin hole in the bushing looks to be quite small.

I'd like to either have a replacement firing pin made or in the alternative purchase one that could be fitted (I assume the firing pin tip would need to be turned down).

Any suggestions for a source for either the drawings or the firing pin?
  
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
jy3855
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 368
Location: California
Joined: Jul 13th, 2015
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #1 - Oct 22nd, 2018 at 10:32am
Print Post  
Have you tried contacting Montana Vintage Arms (406 388-4027)?† They make a nice flat-spring High Wall action and sell parts as well. They may have exactly what you need.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kensmachine
Senior Forum Member
****
Offline



Posts: 342
Joined: Nov 21st, 2012
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #2 - Oct 22nd, 2018 at 10:43am
Print Post  
No need to have one made just get one from MVA you need to know the diameter of the firing pin tip. One more thing a lot 1885 turned in to Varmenters in the 50's & 60's had a Nieder-Mann firing pin installed. Ken    (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Remington40x
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 161
Location: Bucks County, PA
Joined: Oct 18th, 2007
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #3 - Oct 22nd, 2018 at 11:09am
Print Post  
Ken:

Without having the old firing pin, how would I tell if a Niedner-Mann firing pin had been installed?  Were there other modifications to the internal parts that might be a clue?

The bushing in the breech face has no visible screws, if that helps.

Rem
  
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 2748
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #4 - Oct 22nd, 2018 at 1:42pm
Print Post  
Does it still have the screw and a way to put it back in from the rear? If so, the face is probably just bushed, but not a Niedner type. What holds the bushing in could be a pin from the front or side that is smoothed over very neatly, so hard to see.
  

happily ignored by J. "Sonny" Louis
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Remington40x
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 161
Location: Bucks County, PA
Joined: Oct 18th, 2007
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #5 - Oct 22nd, 2018 at 1:53pm
Print Post  
Calledflyer:

I'll have to look at it tonight when I get home.  It's still disassembled, so I should be able to tell pretty quickly.

Thanks.

Rem
  
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
JLouis
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 6785
Joined: Apr 8th, 2009
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #6 - Oct 22nd, 2018 at 4:36pm
Print Post  
Might also take a look at the back of the breech block and see if the firing is bushed and slotted if so the bushing simply unscrews to remove the firing pin.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bpjack
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1165
Location: East Olympia, WA
Joined: May 18th, 2008
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #7 - Oct 22nd, 2018 at 5:52pm
Print Post  
I have an older HW with the horizontal retaining pin instead of the screw.  I see there is one of the pins on eBay new today.  I believe the over all size is the same with the location of the cut out being the difference.

Jack
  

ASSRA # 11318
Yesterday I did nothing and today I'm finishing what I did yesterday.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
beltfed
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1139
Location: Central Wi
Joined: Dec 20th, 2007
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #8 - Oct 22nd, 2018 at 10:55pm
Print Post  
If the firing pin is of the Niedner type, the back of the
breech block will have a "simple" hole.
If it is still of the original type, there will be a slot down below the hole for the retracting leg.
beltfed/arnie
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
oldman46
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 191
Joined: Sep 21st, 2016
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #9 - Oct 23rd, 2018 at 12:59am
Print Post  
If memory serves I seem to remember Van Patten was a gunsmith either in upstate NY or located in Pa. Was one of the better smiths who specialized in reboring barrels, but did gunsmithing as well. So if the same Van Patten at least part of your mystery is solved as to who worked on your rifle. Frank
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 2748
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #10 - Oct 23rd, 2018 at 12:47pm
Print Post  
Beltfed, that's what I missed in my reply above. The Niedner types have that alteration so the pin is trapped into the block at each end. Thanks for filling in 'the rest of the story'. Sometimes it takes a village..............Who said that?
  

happily ignored by J. "Sonny" Louis
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Remington40x
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 161
Location: Bucks County, PA
Joined: Oct 18th, 2007
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #11 - Oct 23rd, 2018 at 2:58pm
Print Post  
I looked carefully at the breech block last evening.  There is a slot cut into the rear of the block, so I think the firing pin type requires the "tongue" that hangs down, which MVA has for sale.  Their pin is too large for the bushing, but I'm thinking my gunsmith can either turn it down or cut off the pin tip, drill a hole and silver solder in a tip of the correct diameter.

The firing pin retention device appears to be a pin that goes cross-wise in the breech block.

The bushing is a complete mystery.  I can't see any threads or slots in the rear and if there's a retention device of any kind holding it in, I couldn't find it.  Maybe it was fitted and then ground down to flush with the breech block.  I guess I'll find out.
  
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 2748
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #12 - Oct 23rd, 2018 at 3:28pm
Print Post  
Could be soldered in. Whatever, if it isn't falling out, forget it.
  

happily ignored by J. "Sonny" Louis
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Remington40x
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 161
Location: Bucks County, PA
Joined: Oct 18th, 2007
Re: Engineer Drawings for Early Hi-Wall Firing Pin
Reply #13 - Oct 23rd, 2018 at 4:24pm
Print Post  
Iím not going to worry about the bushing, which looks solid.  A call to my gunsmith and then Iíll order the firing pin.
  
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send TopicPrint