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Dellet
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Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Dec 15th, 2018 at 2:44pm
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Looking for ideas, fixed cartridge or breech.

This will be in a model 44, so would like to either keep the weight down or a bullet that does well at lower velocity to keep pressure down.

Any thoughts or if you have something available appreciated.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #1 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 3:20pm
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It would help a lot if you could give the groove diameter. There are a lot of new 7mm molds, most are in the .288 range and I think some as large as .290.

There are a few that will cast .285-6 though.

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #2 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 3:41pm
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Bore slugs at a fat .285 and can not feel any loose spots, feels pretty consistent.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #3 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 4:12pm
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What twist rate do you have.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #4 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 4:30pm
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Dellet wrote on Dec 15th, 2018 at 3:41pm:
Bore slugs at a fat .285 and can not feel any loose spots, feels pretty consistent.

I'm assuming a standard 14 twist?

Frank
  

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #5 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 4:54pm
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I thought it was a 13, but probably confusing that with the 25-21. It is the standard Stevens twist compared to the catalogs but would have to double check but memory is questionable.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #6 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 5:13pm
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Appears Frank can be of more help with his assumptions so its probably best to just let him work with you from this point on.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #7 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 5:35pm
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JLouis wrote on Dec 15th, 2018 at 5:13pm:
Appears Frank can be of more help with his assumptions so its probably best to just let him work with you from this point on.


Don't be such a jackass. I asked a very broad question and both of you called me on not having enough information to get the help I am looking for. He may know Stevens better, but I don't think he holds the only useful knowledge that can help.

I've posted before about certain people getting in the way of helping less knowledgeable people because of their issues with each other. Bow out if you must, but your opinion is valued by me.

I will verify twist when I get home as that will make a big difference in he possibility of shooting a slow heavy bullet.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #8 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 6:42pm
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Was not trying to be a Jackass I wanted to help you with your needs and why I asked you what the twist rate was in the first place. Having a bit of a real hard and challenging day, not thinking real straight, have had better and just wanted to back out of the conversation. Frank is very capable and has the knowledge to help fullfil yours needs I just felt it best for me to back for now. If I see something here I can help you with after the information has been shared and if can then be of any help I will jump back in and do what I can. I Apologize for the attitude it was only going to get worse along with my day.

JLouis
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #9 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 7:10pm
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If it's a 14 twist or faster, this bullet mold should work and it's in stock:

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Frank

PS, I'm sorry your having a bad day, JL.
  

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #10 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 7:21pm
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One other thing, if your thinking of buying that mold, check your bore diameter, to make sure that the bore riding section of the bullet, will be within .002 of it.

Frank
  

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #11 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 7:54pm
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JLouis wrote on Dec 15th, 2018 at 6:42pm:
Was not trying to be a Jackass I wanted to help you with your needs and why I asked you what the twist rate was in the first place. Having a bit of a real hard and challenging day, not thinking real straight, have had better and just wanted to back out of the conversation. Frank is very capable and has the knowledge to help fullfil yours needs I just felt it best for me to back for now. If I see something here I can help you with after the information has been shared and if can then be of any help I will jump back in and do what I can. I Apologize for the attitude it was only going to get worse along with my day.

JLouis


No problem sir, probably should have included the smiley face or something. Bad days suck enough having some knucklehead piling on.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #12 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 8:06pm
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frnkeore wrote on Dec 15th, 2018 at 7:10pm:
If it's a 14 twist or faster, this bullet mold should work and it's in stock:

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Frank

PS, I'm sorry your having a bad day, JL.


Twist verified at 1/14. Slug is 279/285

I have actually been looking at that mold and I think it would work. Should be stable at lower velocities, so reduced loads would work.

Any other thoughts?
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #13 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 8:19pm
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Frank has recommended a bullet that should do well.
It is gyroscopically stable for your twist.
I generally shoot bullets .002 wider than my groove-to-groove diameter.

Caliber      0.287      Inches                  
Bullet Weight      154      Grains                  
Bullet Length      0.951      Inches                  
Barrel Twist      14      Inches/turn                  
muzzle velocity      1470      fps                  
Temperature      50      degrees Fahrenheit (59 is standard)                  
Pressure      29.92      inches of mercury (29.92 is standard)                  
                             
Sg =      1.64                        


  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #14 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 8:41pm
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This is one from Accurate that I thought about. It is on the edge for stability, making downloading less appealing. It would need to stay around 1500 fps.

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #15 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 9:04pm
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Nice looking bullet Dellet and I tend to agree with you on stability. Having a bullet of that design for a 14 twist the rule of thumb based on how I was taught. To do what it is I am thinking you are trying to accomplish would be for it to be around .864 in length and being closer to the 134gr. weight range.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #16 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 9:25pm
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JLouis wrote on Dec 15th, 2018 at 9:04pm:
Nice looking bullet Dellet and I tend to agree with you on stability. Having a bullet of that design for a 14 twist the rule of thumb based on how I was taught. To do what it is I am thinking you are trying to accomplish would be for it to be around .864 in length and being closer to the 134gr. weight range.


They have the same basic bullet with one less band and not tapered 130 grains.

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #17 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 9:25pm
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Caliber      0.286      Inches            
Bullet Weight      152      Grains            
Bullet Length      1.01      Inches            
Barrel Twist      14      Inches/turn            
muzzle velocity      1470      fps            
Temperature      50      degrees Fahrenheit (59 is standard)            
Pressure      29.92      inches of mercury (29.92 is standard)            
                       
Sg =      1.36                  


Yup the longer 152 grain would be unstable when the weather changed or when the velocity was too slow.

You should have a tighter twist to shoot it or use a shorter lighter bullet as John suggests.


Caliber      0.286      Inches            
Bullet Weight      130      Grains            
Bullet Length      0.86      Inches            
Barrel Twist      14      Inches/turn            
muzzle velocity      1470      fps            
Temperature      50      degrees Fahrenheit (59 is standard)            
Pressure      29.92      inches of mercury (29.92 is standard)            
                       
Sg =      1.83                  
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #18 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 9:38pm
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Schuetzendave wrote on Dec 15th, 2018 at 9:25pm:
Caliber      0.286      Inches            
Bullet Weight      152      Grains            
Bullet Length      1.01      Inches            
Barrel Twist      14      Inches/turn            
muzzle velocity      1470      fps            
Temperature      50      degrees Fahrenheit (59 is standard)            
Pressure      29.92      inches of mercury (29.92 is standard)            
                       
Sg =      1.36                  


Yup the longer 152 grain would be unstable when the weather changed or when the velocity was too slow.

You should have a tighter twist to shoot it or use a shorter lighter bullet as John suggests.


Caliber      0.286      Inches            
Bullet Weight      130      Grains            
Bullet Length      0.86      Inches            
Barrel Twist      14      Inches/turn            
muzzle velocity      1470      fps            
Temperature      50      degrees Fahrenheit (59 is standard)            
Pressure      29.92      inches of mercury (29.92 is standard)            
                       
Sg =      1.83                  


Below 1.4 the quality of the bullet makes the difference. If the bore wasnt 125 years old it might have a better chance.

Im sure this will have a couple failures, but too much success without work kinda takes the fun out it.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #19 - Dec 15th, 2018 at 10:16pm
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I like that 130B bullet better than the NOE but, I hate their min meplats of .180. It would be much better, balistically with a .08 - .100 meplat.

If you get the 130B, have them make the first band, .282, it will help with BSing.

Frank
  

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #20 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 12:56am
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frnkeore wrote on Dec 15th, 2018 at 10:16pm:
I like that 130B bullet better than the NOE but, I hate their min meplats of .180. It would be much better, balistically with a .08 - .100 meplat.

If you get the 130B, have them make the first band, .282, it will help with BSing.

Frank

They offer the tapered design as #125M.
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #21 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 11:50am
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Below 1.4 the quality of the bullet makes the difference.


It is not the quality of the bullet - it is the length of the bullet.
If it is too long for your barrel's twist to gyroscopically stabilize it; it will not be spinning fast enough and will tumble.
It may tumble immediately or a short distance down range and more so if the weather is colder or the atmospheric pressure is higher.
« Last Edit: Dec 16th, 2018 at 11:58am by Schuetzendave »  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #22 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 1:07pm
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Schuetzendave wrote on Dec 16th, 2018 at 11:50am:
Below 1.4 the quality of the bullet makes the difference.


It is not the quality of the bullet - it is the length of the bullet.
If it is too long for your barrel's twist to gyroscopically stabilize it; it will not be spinning fast enough and will tumble.
It may tumble immediately or a short distance down range and more so if the weather is colder or the atmospheric pressure is higher.


I would argue that from personal experience, and qualify it with distance shot, and bullet construction. I shoot a lot of subsonic rifle, cast, jacketed and lathe cut solids. The smoother the bearing surface, the lower the SG number you can get away with on target. Jacketed bullet tend to be more forgiving than CNC turned monolithic bullets for this reason.

As with almost anything in loading, what the target shows and what science says are not always in sync. What I can say is that a 240 Matchking in a 1/10 at 1000 fps, will still make round holes in the target at 250 yards with an SG of less than 1.3. And most cast .125 shorter will have trouble at 100. Monolithic bullets with grooves are somewhere in between. Grooves cause turbulence.

Maybe if I shot better I could see the difference in group size due to stability, but the 1.6 SG number is there as guideline for maximum BC as well. Just because the bullet is not reaching maximum BC potential, does not automatically mean it is not stable.

Just what I have experienced on target.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #23 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 1:36pm
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Truer words could not be spoken: " From personal experience. " All though there are several programs out there that seem to be providing good, honest and trusted information. My own personal experience has proven that it has not always been so and one can end up purchasing the wrong bullet design to fit his or her needs. If you can come across someone who is already doing what it is you are wanting to accomplish and having great success. I have found it is has been by far the better way to achieve the same type of success.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #24 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 5:02pm
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Quote:
As with almost anything in loading, what the target shows and what science says are not always in sync. What I can say is that a 240 Matchking in a 1/10 at 1000 fps, will still make round holes in the target at 250 yards with an SG of less than 1.3. And most cast .125 shorter will have trouble at 100. Monolithic bullets with grooves are somewhere in between. Grooves cause turbulence.

The major reason that what your saying is true, is because the Match King and all most all, cast bullets in that weight range, being shorter will have a much different CG.

Regarding smooth bullets, at subsonic. The surface will make some difference in the BC, because at subsonic, laminar flow, as to be maintained, for maximum airflow, lowering the air friction and turbulence, over the surface.

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #25 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 5:20pm
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frnkeore wrote on Dec 16th, 2018 at 5:02pm:
Quote:
As with almost anything in loading, what the target shows and what science says are not always in sync. What I can say is that a 240 Matchking in a 1/10 at 1000 fps, will still make round holes in the target at 250 yards with an SG of less than 1.3. And most cast .125 shorter will have trouble at 100. Monolithic bullets with grooves are somewhere in between. Grooves cause turbulence.

The major reason that what your saying is true, is because the Match King and all most all, cast bullets in that weight range, being shorter will have a much different CG.

Regarding smooth bullets, at subsonic. The surface will make some difference in the BC, because at subsonic, laminar flow, as to be maintained, for maximum airflow, lowering the air friction and turbulence, over the surface.

Frank


This is why I say bullet construction or shape can allow for a larger window of stability.

The problem with radial grooves in a bullet is that they will actually speed up the air moving over the bullet at that point. When you get into the trans sonic speeds you get turbulence at the grooves that tend to be at the base. The nose can be sub sonic not creating a shock wave, the base can be super creating a wave off the grooves. This idea has actually been filmed.

About the 5 min mark.
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One of the things I am finding out shooting subsonic is the amount of in flight bullet noise there is. Noise is basically turbulence. Turbulence causes instability. Unless you have a program that can simulate a wind tunnel, the stability calculators will not factor in bullet shape.

Guys that can get cast bullets flying well in some ways beat science all to death. They knew what worked well 100 years ago, in some ways science is just now explaining what the smart guys simply figured out worked.

Its that knowledge base Im hoping to tap into.
« Last Edit: Dec 16th, 2018 at 6:46pm by Dellet »  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #26 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 7:07pm
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You are jumping between dynamic stability and gyroscopic stability.

Your arguement is about bullet shapes and effects on center of gravity etc.

However you first need gyroscopic stability first before dynamic stability comes into play.

The barrel twist and bullet length determine gyroscopic stability and it has impacts on bullet stability before dynamic stability from forward motion has an effect.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #27 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 7:11pm
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Dave who's comments are you referring too and what was the information being shared.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #28 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 8:34pm
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Schuetzendave wrote on Dec 16th, 2018 at 7:07pm:
You are jumping between dynamic stability and gyroscopic stability.

Your arguement is about bullet shapes and effects on center of gravity etc.

However you first need gyroscopic stability first before dynamic stability comes into play.

The barrel twist and bullet length determine gyroscopic stability and it has impacts on bullet stability before dynamic stability from forward motion has an effect.


I think my argument would be that gyroscopic and dynamic can work with or against each other, and that is where shape comes into play. Otherwise if you took it to an extreme, you could shoot the same bullet backwards and forwards with equal results and performance.

A bullet could be designed that way, and many actually do fly reasonably well backwards, but its just not the same.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #29 - Dec 16th, 2018 at 11:39pm
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Pretty simple.

Ballisticians state it is impossible to have dynamic stability until you first have gyroscopic stability.

So you need the proper selection of bullet length for your barrel twist before it will be gyroscopically stable.

No bullet shape will restore a bullet that is  gyroscopically unstable.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #30 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 1:53am
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Dave,
Run this bullet and twist combination through your miller program and see if you think it can shoot a .52, point on group at 100 yards.

.321 groove, 15 twist Douglas, using the Lyman 320366 bullet.

Frank
  

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #31 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 6:58am
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Frank:

Sure it can work under certain weather conditions or at short distances and when you increase the velocities to increase the spin rate.
How does it perform at 300 yards?
Can you verify your barrel twist to decimal one place? Since you are on the edge we need to know your exact twist.

Caliber      0.321      Inches            
Bullet Weight      187      Grains            
Bullet Length      1.18      Inches            
Barrel Twist      15      Inches/turn            
muzzle velocity      1600      fps            
Temperature      100      degrees Fahrenheit (59 is standard)            
Pressure      28      inches of mercury (29.92 is standard)            
                       
Sg =      1.39                  


I prefer to select a bullet and appropriate barrel twist that will perform well over longer distances and under all weather conditions without pushing cast bullets at high velocities.

Caliber      0.321      Inches            
Bullet Weight      235.1      Grains            
Bullet Length      1.299      Inches            
Barrel Twist      11.5      Inches/turn            
muzzle velocity      1470      fps            
Temperature      50      degrees Fahrenheit (59 is standard)            
Pressure      29.92      inches of mercury (29.92 is standard)            
                       
Sg =      1.87                  
« Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2018 at 9:31am by Schuetzendave »  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #32 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 9:30am
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Schuetzendave wrote on Dec 16th, 2018 at 11:39pm:
Pretty simple.

Ballisticians state it is impossible to have dynamic stability until you first have gyroscopic stability.

So you need the proper selection of bullet length for your barrel twist before it will be gyroscopically stable.

No bullet shape will restore a bullet that is gyroscopically unstable.


No argument there at all.

But shape will determine the center of pressure which is ultimately what will cause the bullet to tumble.

One of the best examples of this is Berger bullets own calculator and their 30 cal. Flatbase bullets. To say their is a discrepancy between the twist required on the box, and using their own calculator would be an understatement.

The bullet Frank posted will likely fall into that same category and is why Berger posts a disclaimer with heir calculator, advising that it will not be accurate for flat base bullets.

  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #33 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 3:01pm
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Dave,
My Miller program, gives a different out put.

This is what my Sg program says about that bullet and twist rate.

Frank
  

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #34 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 3:05pm
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Oh, now I see, you raise the temp to 100 and lowered the pressure to sever storm level.

My programs inputs are both std, default levels.

Frank
  

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #35 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 3:09pm
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Here are some example of calculators not doing flat base bullets justice. JBM which uses the Miller formula and Berger bullets because they publish the specs needed for the calculator and recommended twist for each bullet.

These are both .243 Varmint bullets # 24313, 24321. Berger recommended twist is 1/12.

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Quote:
Stability
Input Data
Caliber:      0.243 in      Bullet Weight:      69.0 gr
Bullet Length:      0.919 in      Plastic Tip Length:      0.000 in
Muzzle Velocity:      3000.0 ft/s      Barrel Twist:      12.0 in
Temperature:      59.0 F      Pressure:      29.92 in Hg
Output Data
Stability:      1.046


Quote:
Stability
Input Data
Caliber:      0.243 in      Bullet Weight:      69.0 gr
Bullet Length:      0.919 in      Plastic Tip Length:      0.000 in
Muzzle Velocity:      3000.0 ft/s      Barrel Twist:      9.8 in
Temperature:      59.0 F      Pressure:      29.92 in Hg
Output Data
Stability:      1.584      
     


Something that has a shape more like something that you could cast.

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Quote:
Stability
Input Data
Caliber:      0.243 in      Bullet Weight:      80.0 gr
Bullet Length:      0.913 in      Plastic Tip Length:      0.000 in
Muzzle Velocity:      3000.0 ft/s      Barrel Twist:      12.0 in
Temperature:      59.0 F      Pressure:      29.92 in Hg
Output Data
Stability:      1.236      




Quote:
Stability
Input Data
Caliber:      0.243 in      Bullet Weight:      80.0 gr
Bullet Length:      0.913 in      Plastic Tip Length:      0.000 in
Muzzle Velocity:      3000.0 ft/s      Barrel Twist:      10.5 in
Temperature:      59.0 F      Pressure:      29.92 in Hg
Output Data
Stability:      1.614            
1


150 grain .308 #30407, recommended twist 1/15

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Quote:
Stability
Input Data
Caliber:      0.308 in      Bullet Weight:      150.0 gr
Bullet Length:      1.155 in      Plastic Tip Length:      0.000 in
Muzzle Velocity:      2800.0 ft/s      Barrel Twist:      15.0 in
Temperature:      59.0 F      Pressure:      29.92 in Hg
Output Data
Stability:      1.150      


Quote:
Stability
Input Data
Caliber:      0.308 in      Bullet Weight:      150.0 gr
Bullet Length:      1.155 in      Plastic Tip Length:      0.000 in
Muzzle Velocity:      2800.0 ft/s      Barrel Twist:      12.5 in
Temperature:      59.0 F      Pressure:      29.92 in Hg
Output Data
Stability:      1.656      


That's why they don't recommend it for flat base
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #36 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 3:34pm
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Many modern, long ogive bullets, have a extreme rearward GC (lead core in the rear and hollow jacket forward). It is this CG position that allow them to shoot in slower twists.

As near as I can tell, running comparisons between my program and the Miller. The default Miller bullet is either a cylinder or a VERY short ogive bullet giving the CG about the center.

Frank
  

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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #37 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 4:31pm
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frnkeore wrote on Dec 17th, 2018 at 3:34pm:
Many modern, long ogive bullets, have a extreme rearward GC (lead core in the rear and hollow jacket forward). It is this CG position that allow them to shoot in slower twists.

As near as I can tell, running comparisons between my program and the Miller. The default Miller bullet is either a cylinder or a VERY short ogive bullet giving the CG about the center.

Frank


Another interesting thing to do with JBM is to check bullets with a plastic tip.

This is a 178 grain Hornady Amax with a plastic tip.
Quote:
Stability
Input Data
Caliber:      0.308 in      Bullet Weight:      178.0 gr
Bullet Length:      1.318 in      Plastic Tip Length:      0.138 in
Muzzle Velocity:      1600.0 ft/s      Barrel Twist:      12.0 in
Temperature:      59.0 F      Pressure:      29.92 in Hg
Output Data
Stability:      1.489      


Same bullet with the tip length at zero
Quote:
Stability
Input Data
Caliber:      0.308 in      Bullet Weight:      178.0 gr
Bullet Length:      1.318 in      Plastic Tip Length:      0.000 in
Muzzle Velocity:      1600.0 ft/s      Barrel Twist:      12.0 in
Temperature:      59.0 F      Pressure:      29.92 in Hg
Output Data
Stability:      1.209      


So clearly the shape and weight distribution have meaning when it comes to stability, but getting the accurate data points needed to predict it is difficult.

Variations of lube grooves in cast bullet at the back of the bullet, will play with the stability just as the plastic tip does in the front.

You can get an idea, but ultimately, you're going to have to shoot them.

  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #38 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 5:26pm
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Very knowledgeable information Dellet your interest intrigues me. If you don't have Mann's book on The Bullets Flight I think you might be one of the very few who would enjoy it as much as I have.

JLouis
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #39 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 5:56pm
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Not sure if this is still available but if anyone has an interest it would be hard to beat this price.

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JLouis
« Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2018 at 6:24pm by JLouis »  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #40 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 9:48pm
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Dellet one of our competitors and a close friend has been swagging his bullets now for quite sometime. He gets his Dies from I believe Blackwell and all though the lead wire is 1-30 and and the hardest I believe he can use. The knurled bullets and the means for the bullet lube thus not having any lube grooves have actually been shooting quite well.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #41 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 10:10pm
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Also not sure if you received my last PM that might be of some help to you and if not please let me know and I would be more than happy to re-send.
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #42 - Dec 17th, 2018 at 10:18pm
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JLouis wrote on Dec 17th, 2018 at 9:48pm:
Dellet one of our competitors and a close friend has been swagging his bullets now for quite sometime. He gets his Dies from I believe Blackwell and all though the lead wire is 1-30 and and the hardest I believe he can use. The knurled bullets and the means for the bullet lube thus not having any lube grooves have actually been shooting quite well.


Are those by or similar to the ones that Dave Bennett does?

I have seen some write ups of those and they are interesting, any real different results that you have seen?
  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #43 - Dec 18th, 2018 at 12:59pm
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Yes similar to Bennett's but I believe the nose forming die he uses is different. I think the big benefit is the lack of having the air pockets that can be cast into poured bullets creating unbalanced bullets. All the bases are flat, the edges sharp and probably more identically the same. A poured bullet shrinks after being poured and can shrink out of round. And there are no lube grooves to disrupt the air flow Dellet and he does quite well with them. The only thing I don't care for is I like a harder bullet and one of 1-16 tin and lead alloy. I feel it helps greatly to keep the unsupported spitzer nose from slumping off center from both shrinking in length to fill the grooves and the centrifugal forces being applied to it. In Mann's testing the X factor he could not eliminate was the lack of achieving perfectly balanced bullets.

JLouis
« Last Edit: Dec 18th, 2018 at 1:07pm by JLouis »  
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Re: Mould/bullet recommendation for 28-30, Stevens
Reply #44 - Mar 26th, 2019 at 5:03pm
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Quote:
Any thoughts or if you have something available appreciated.

Old thread but for what's it worth for consideration:
* Accurate Molds has a 120gr clone of the Ideal 28-30-120 Stevens bullet .... (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
The bore on an original 28-30 Stevens is 279/282


  

Regards
John
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