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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) primer pocket shims (Read 1826 times)
.22-5-40
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primer pocket shims
Mar 16th, 2019 at 11:58am
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Had some time on my hands between jobs & had a brainstorm.  I had read where using large pistol primers in regular large rifle pockets could lead to peening of breech block face due to shorter pistol primers getting running start and slamming into block.  Now I don't know how much of a run they could get in only .008"..the height difference between the LR & LP primer, but I turned up some half-hard brass to .2105" dia. & drilled .062" hole thru.  Using thin part off tool made from tool bit, I parted off a dozen .008" shims.  Hardest part was catching those little suckers before they got lost in chip pan.
    Now then, do you think using these would be practicle..and worthwhile?..any thoughts on danger?  Thanks!
  
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marlinguy
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #1 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 12:24pm
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Seems like a futile effort when the correct primers aren't any more expensive than the incorrect primers? Simpler solution is just use the correct primer.
  

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Fred Boulton
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #2 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 12:48pm
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Superb! A classic enthusiasts solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
Fred
  
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frnkeore
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #3 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 12:49pm
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As a machinist, it sounds like a LOT of work! And as you note, dropping them in the chip pan would be very frustrating too!! BTW, how do you deburr them?

Now regarding them hurting the face of the breech block. Until I went to the 357 Max case, I used F150's in ALL my rifles that took LRP's including 3 HW's, 1 Borchardt, one 44 1/2, 1 Sys Will and  my non harden Hoch. I never had any damage to the face of the breech block, in any of them.

You could also try making bushings, to use SRP in the large primer pockets. That might bare more fruit.

Frank
  

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.22-5-40
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #4 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 12:57pm
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I didn't say, but the reason for the pistol primer was for gentler ingnition ..greater accuracy?  with black powder loads. 
Frnkeore..I have been thinking of turning up some stainless LR-SR bushings..have to come up with a .1745" dia. reamer...perhaps make up a half reamer?
  
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Premod70
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #5 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 1:13pm
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Heard someone a while back that was using a c-clip or snap ring of some sorts for that purpose but that went in one ear and out the other.
  
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JLouis
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #6 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 1:15pm
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I simply made a swage to reduce the Large Rifle Primer pocket depths to minimum Large Pistol Primer depth specs. I have also seen the damage to the breech block face that some would say does not exist. Kermit Hoke ( Kermittool ) now retired also used to make and sell the same type of primer pocket reducing depth tool for use on a reloading press.
« Last Edit: Mar 16th, 2019 at 1:37pm by JLouis »  
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JerryH
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #7 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 1:19pm
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Kermit Hoke used to make a primer pocket tool that would reduce a large rifle primer case to a large pistol primer depth. I have one I used when I was still shooting BPCR Silhouette. Not sure if he still has any or not, but you could check.

JerryH
  

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frnkeore
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #8 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 1:50pm
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.22-5-40 wrote on Mar 16th, 2019 at 12:57pm:
Frnkeore..I have been thinking of turning up some stainless LR-SR bushings..have to come up with a .1745" dia. reamer...perhaps make up a half reamer?

The only way that I would make them, is with a CNC, screw machine or at the bare minimum, a small turret. There isn't much tolerance on the ID size so, the reamer would have to either float or be very close, on center, to work out.

Frank
  

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JLouis
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #9 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 1:59pm
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I believe this is a Kermit Hoke there was another gentleman who was making and selling them too. Mine is much more simplified and for use in an arbor press.

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cheatin_charlie
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #10 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 4:00pm
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I also had the non existance breechblock peened on my High Wall using large pistol primers in a 40-65 using black powder.  I took the shell holder and ground
a slot in it to accept paper strips of the required thickness.  When priming put paper in slot and ran primer thru it into case.  I now can use pistol primers and also paper in front of primer to lessen primer flash.  I sold my High Wall but now
use the same technique on Stevens 32-40 with blackpowder.  It did improve accuracy for me.
Waiting for summer so I can shoot some bragging groups with black powder.
  
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gunlaker
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #11 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 5:25pm
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I use pistol primers in some loads with BP as I get a little better SD's in some cases.   Meacham Tool & Die used to make a swaging tool but he retired before I could order one.

Kirk at Shiloh advises not to use pistol primers in the rifles he makes.  He has seen breech blocks damaged by them.  I use them in one of my Shiloh Sharps rifles, but it worked out for me as I bought a bunch of defective Remington brass that had shallow primer pockets that just happen to only work with pistol primers Smiley

Chris.
  
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #12 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 6:19pm
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I too tried pistol primers last fall in my 40-85 Ballard.....the first 200 yd group showed a huge improvement. Was worried about denting the breech, but a dozen shots seemed ok. Considered paper under primer for a spacer but have not tried it yet. A top shooter we all know told me about trying the pistol primers. If money was no problem I would have a new custom made batch of brass for the small primers.
  
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Mick B
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #13 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 7:45pm
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With my 40-60 CPA I found that ignition was a bit iffy when using large pistol primers and the problem was solved by seating the primers through newspaper, no more iffy ignitions.
I wrongly thought that perhaps the firing pin in my CPA was a trifle short so I ordered another from Gail. When it arrived (free of charge ) I measured it and found that it was exactly the same length as the one in my rifle, so that screwed that theory.
Anyway seating the LMP primers through paper solved the problem and is no hardship, also costs  nothing to do.
Mike.
  
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JLouis
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Re: primer pocket shims
Reply #14 - Mar 16th, 2019 at 8:07pm
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Primers do make a difference and all of them should be tried. I have been having great success with the Federal Large Pistol Magnum Match with 300MP and the powder used also comes into play. But I also highly recommend that you don't use Pistol Primers unless the primer pockets have been reduced to the LP minimum specs. I would never encourage anyone to do anything that would or could damage a breech block face and why I would never advocate their use if the primer pockets depth has not first been reduced. And this is what I do and use in my 32-40.
« Last Edit: Mar 16th, 2019 at 8:18pm by JLouis »  
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