If the arch of the bullets was the reason for "tipping"
they would all have vertical oval holes, not random directions.
beltfed/arnie

JLouis wrote on Jul 10^th, 2019 at 10:15am:

How do you know  year old bullets wouldn't be better? 

All the bullets listed are longer than mine which is .996” OAL with bands taking up .717” of that. Any ideas on how long a bullet will reduce the tipping at 1400 fps?  I'm shooting 14.25 4227 in a Ballard which should be plenty in a Ballard, eh?

I noticed today shooting CBA  there didn't seem to be any tipping at 100 yards, most shots held the 10 ring with new lube.  That wasn't possible at 200 in better conditions.

I'm beginning to think the tipping makes the lube issue more critical.  Too bad I never shot 100 ASSRA   

Edit:  I have a target on lighter paper I just examined that was shot a couple months ago with slightly darker lube than was shot today. There is evidence of tipping.  10 shots at 100 yds produced 9 shots in a single hole .538" wide and .274" high with a wide single bullet flyer centered .290" from the edge of the 9 shot hole.

At 200 yds the next 10 shots were 9 in about 1.75" with a flyer opening to 3". The next 10  shots were about 4" at 200 yds and less concentrated in the center.   This is typical of the lube issues.  With good year old lube, this rifle has shot quite a few 10 shot groups under 1" at 200 yds.

I calculated the angles.  At 100 yds, the tipping is approximately 2.5 degrees.  At 200 yards, it is just under 5 degrees. I only had one hole to measure at 100, but most of the shots at 200 were individual hits and the measurement was consistent.  The  angle originated around the clock face without a predominate entrance direction.

I clean with a few patches of Birchwood Casey bore cleaner Then use G96 to oil the bore. 

Maybe I just need to schedule my shooting a year in advance so the lube will be in prime condition. 

In top form, it shoots much better than Pope guaranteed    Maybe if more shooters shot tippy bullets, they would have tighter groups confirming my experience and I shouldn't worry about it?

Bob,
Go back and look at the targets I post on page 2.

The tipping isn't a result of twist, it is because of the buffeting occurring, while bullet is in the transonic range. Although your tipping isn't as sever as mine, I suspect that your tipping is happening for the same reason.

Your bullet is plenty short for your twist rate so, go to 14.8 to 15.0 gr or drop the charge to 13.5. In my posted targets, there is no other change but, .5 gr change from 13.0 to 13.5 in the powder charge and I haven't had tipping at that load since. Also, when I built that rifle, there was no data for it (33 ELCO Max) so, I started at 11 gr of 4227 with a borrow PJ bullet that was 1.21 long (my bullet is 1.19) and I didn't have tipping at those lower velocity's either.

Later that day that I shot the tipped target, I shot the 5 five shot group match @ 100 yards, I averaged .53, with the small group of .33, again with no tipping with the +.5 gr load.

Frank

I haven't chrono'd this since the mid 90s.  I should probably do that.  I just looked at the old Lyman manual.  It had 14 hrs 4227 as max at about 1300 fps.  I may have my old black powder velocities mixed up with my 33-47 memory